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Vanity Universe 2009 Skin Fair organisers ejecting avatars on suspicion of ‘wearing stolen skin’

A member of one of my SL groups (Fashion Emergency), Sun Marseille, a visitor to the skin fair, was ejected by Nadja Baxter, one of the organisers. She had no idea why, and so sent an IM to Nadja asking why; she was told ‘you’re wearing a stolen skin’. A log of Sun’s conversation with Nadja Baxter is reproduced below:

[17:30] Sun Marseille: why did you eject me?
[17:30] Nadja Baxter: your wear a stolen skin
[17:31] Sun Marseille: nniumm no
[17:31] Sun Marseille: dont be ridiculous
[17:37] Sun Marseille: how do you know what skin im wearing and who are you to boot me without asking me first?
[17:38] Nadja Baxter: sorry i have not time for people like you
[17:39] Nadja Baxter: buy your skins from the original creator and you are wellcome 🙂
[17:40] Sun Marseille: are you nuts??
[17:49] Nadja Baxter: ask to hwher you bought this skin ?
[17:50] Nadja Baxter: no answer ?
[17:50] Nadja Baxter: no answer ?
[17:54] Nadja Baxter: so where you bought this skin?
[17:56] Sun Marseille: little late to ask me now.. isnt it?
[17:56] Nadja Baxter: is it a secret
[17:57] Sun Marseille: not at all
[17:57] Nadja Baxter: you are very wellcome
[17:57] Nadja Baxter: but whre you buy this shin ?
[17:58] Sun Marseille: im sorry .. but you severly disrespected me.. if you had asked me BEFORE kicking me out .. I would have been nice
[17:59] Nadja Baxter: hum yes that can bee

The skin in question was bought from Le Mode ( http://slurl.com/secondlife/Turnip/56/144/3001 ), created by Milla Crystal.

When contacted, Nadja Baxter declined to comment.

UPDATE: Nadja Baxter issued an apology; the chat log of this is below:

[18:12]  Nadja Baxter: iok i sse you buy from a creator
[18:12]  Nadja Baxter: so i  apology.
[18:13]  Nadja Baxter: you are wellcome at the fair
[18:14]  Nadja Baxter: it is strange for the customuers what is stolen at a skin

Even with the apology, this sort of behaviour on the part of an event organiser is extremely questionable, in my opinion; one hopes that she won’t be quite so precipitous in the future.

le mode 1

Sun Marseille wearing the Le Mode skin Nadja Baxter called 'stolen'

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November 8, 2009 - Posted by | Fashion, Intellectual Property, Second Life, Skin, SL Events | , , , , , , ,

20 Comments »

  1. To be honest, even though the accusation has now been withdrawn, I’m still inclined to stay away from that event. That was a stupid and arrogant thing to do and an apology and unbanning don’t erase the stupidity as far as I’m concerned. I wonder how many others have had this happen? I won’t support witch-hunters.

    And FYI, I am currently in the market for new skins. Too bad huh.

    Comment by Mabb Dilweg | November 8, 2009

  2. Skin theft in Second Life:

    Expensive Skin Maker: I found NARS book first!
    Other Skin Maker: no u didnt
    Expensive Skin Maker: Finders Keepers!
    Other Skin Maker: DRAMAZ
    Expensive Skin Maker: DMCA!

    Weeks pass.

    Expensive Skin Maker: My DMCAs never get action?!
    Other Skin Maker: luzer
    Expensive Skin Maker: SL SUCKS
    Other Skin Maker: *mute*

    And so it goes, the comedy of skin business in Second Life. Does anyone quite see why I decided to just make whatever the hell I like and thats it? I’m a cat, not a rat, damnit.

    no offence meant to rats 😀

    Comment by Hypatia Callisto | November 8, 2009

  3. I’m just curious… why she didn’t answer (or couldn’t answer) the store where she bought the skin? And what did she mean by “I would have been nice”? If she answered Nadja’s question all at once, things might have taken a favorable turn… I guess. 😦

    Comment by Jade Green | November 8, 2009

  4. Well, I’m guessing being ejected without courtesy of a warning/prior explanation, or an inquiry, is what made Sun feel like she was under no obligation to provide any for the organizer, either?

    Comment by melaniekiddofsl | November 8, 2009

  5. Thanks for posting this. I went to the Skin Fair earlier but did not buy anything – I had planned to return tomorrow. Now I won’t go back at all.

    Totally ridiculous

    Comment by Chestnut Rau | November 8, 2009

  6. I was ejected once with no reason at all except the sim owner thought I was TPing in bots to get money at a picks camper. ACTUALLY I had TPed in my friend (Xia) since the board had been out of money for days. Can we all say, “OOOOOH, bad girl?”

    The sim owner told me that Xia was a bot. Since I know her in RL and know she couldn’t possibly be, I protested that. This from the edge of the sim swimming in the water and not being able to move. I was banned, but do you think I cared. And I had just written a very nice review on this witch :D. I don’t remember, but I may have deleted it.

    People need NOT to presume. I am having a difficult time understanding how anyone can spot a stolen skin from a real one. Maybe in the store if you recognize the style of the skin involved and know the designer. But ON? How do you know whether the skin someone is wearing was paid for from the actually designer or purchased from a fraud. And even if it was purchased from a fraud, how is a regular SL resident supposed to know? Guilty until proved innocent with a copy of your transaction history?

    It is a mystery. I agree that some folks are definitely moving into act first and think later mode. I’ve even run into some welcome messages at sims asking you to leave if you don’t have “legitimate” business in that sim. Woah! How can people sell their goods if they turn away shoppers?

    I have no idea why Sun didn’t answer, but I can say that when it happened to me I was so shocked I was very flustered and pretty speechless — for about a minute *wink*.

    Comment by Chic Aeon | November 8, 2009

  7. That is RIDICULOUS. She asked her where Sun bought the skin NINE minutes after Sun’s last comment to her.

    Well, at least I know now where I won’t be going this weekend.

    Comment by Alicia Chenaux | November 8, 2009

  8. Wow, talk about major FAIL on that organizer’s part.

    Comment by James Schwarz | November 8, 2009

  9. Seriously skin makers need to calm down cause most of the ideas steal skins from rl people basing it off celebritys and fashion models. Lets be honest witch hunters you stole your idea skins are based of rl people dmca that

    Comment by Ann | November 8, 2009

  10. Ridiculous…

    I ask myself how someone can be that sure, that someone wears a stolen skin. How could Nadja?

    Every skin looks different on every (self adjusted) shape.

    Comment by momola | November 8, 2009

  11. I was so surprised about this as well. I was intending on showing up to see the new releases from curio and others but now I don’t know if I even want to TP in knowing there’s a chance someone will possibly accuse me of wearing a stolen skin when I’m visiting a skin fair where you buy them.

    I was excited at 12am SLT and was unhappy about having to wait until noon but now I’ll just have to wait until the skins are available at the main stores. Very sad for all the creators who will lose out on possible extra revenue from fair goers who will be avoiding now just to “Save their hide” so to speak from ridiculous prosecution.

    Comment by Verinne Ansar | November 8, 2009

  12. When I was there everyone was a gray blob so how could she even see if she had a skin on? I would have to think a minute to remember what skin I had on. I change more than once a day sometimes so I can totally understand the hesitation but I wouldn’t have answered on the whole principle of it. Nice way to handle PR for the skin fair!

    Comment by Whispers Magic | November 8, 2009

  13. Ew.
    Thanks for sharing, I will not be reading her blog, or taking a visit there anymore.

    Comment by Ashe Anthony | November 8, 2009

  14. hi Guys
    yes I was kicked out without warning & was in shock thinking it must be a mistake. Considering the way i was treated I was under NO obligation to answer her question way after the fact. #1 its none of her business #2 how does she know whats stolen? #3 ejectin me before asking me first ( I would have gladly obliged since I do get asked often ;-)) #4 only apologizing after someone else told her where i got it. And the apology was not the end of it.. she continued to harass me about it afterward until i had to tell her not to talk to me anymore.I wonder how the organizers of this event feel about loosing buyers. Now i have a giant wad of cash in my pocket that I will spend elsewhere. Kinda sad really. But as we all know . SL attracts all kinds. (hugs)

    Comment by Sun Marseille | November 8, 2009

  15. it was an error. I apologize and feel ashamed of this.

    I understood something wrong!

    She was the only one I have banned from the sim ! And it was wrong ! Sorry that did this.

    Comment by Nadja Baxter | November 8, 2009

  16. WTG… you’re “punishing” a whole lot of content creators who invested in this and prepared charity items for CARE in an otherwise very well organised event (sim was full earlier, yet I could still move and everything rezzed)because of a silly incident between the organiser and 1 visitor… Yes, Nadja should have known better, but it’s hardly worth boycotting an event over.

    Comment by Grazia | November 8, 2009

  17. Great Nadja. My respect .

    Mistakes happen….

    Comment by momola | November 8, 2009

  18. I’m not sure who is doing the “punishing” here; Vivi posted events as they happened, including Nadja’s apology, with only one editorial comment made: that the whole thing was questionable and hopefully there will be more thought put into this sort of thing in the future.

    If certain readers walk away from this post feeling that the apology was insufficient, and decide to skip the event based on the facts presented here along with what I think was a fairly neutral opinion (that she should exercise more care in how she deals with sim visitors in the future), that’s *their* choice.

    I personally think it’s commendable that Nadja was big enough to reply to Sun with an apology. Goodness knows there’s a lot of people in SL who can’t even be bothered to do that. But if Sun decides to not go back to the event, I can’t say that I blame her for feeling that way, too.

    Comment by melaniekiddofsl | November 8, 2009

  19. OK look,this was not a “mistake” this was a witch hunt. I don’t want anywhere near the location of a witch hunt. I don’t want associated with it. I refuse to spend my money at such an event. Can you PROVE she only did it to one person? Or did only one person write about it in a popular blog? Hmmm…no way to know. How’s it feel with the shoe on the other foot Nadja? Pinch a little?

    Well, I was going to go back and buy one of the new Curio, but now I will just hold off and get it in the Curio shop…or do without doesn’t matter to me as much as my principals.

    In RL and SL I try my best to make sure my currency doesn’t go to support things I dislike or disapprove of. THIS is the reason to boycott this skin fair over Nadja’s actions.

    Comment by Gertiegolucky | November 8, 2009

  20. hi guys
    I would just prefer to let this drop now.. and move on.. I come to SL for fun,fantasy and friends. The drama is now over for me.No point in keeping this alive. Nadja knows what she did was very wrong and hurtful but life goes on.. lets hope a lesson was learned and we can all go back to having fun 🙂
    And thank you to all those who were very supportive (hugs)..SUN

    Comment by Sun Marseille | November 8, 2009


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